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I have a problem and I need some advice.
First let me say that I am the one looking for advice. I no longer am part of the worship team in our church, but my husband is. So much depends on this and that is why I am here asking for advice..
It is a long story and for that I apologize. Many years ago a married woman came to our small church. She asked me to be her friend. God told me immediately to pray. I didn't understand. I had never had a hard time making friends and I love people. I prayed that I would be a good friend to her, the kind that she needed me to be. After some time had gone by I came to know why God had asked me to pray. I was teaching the youth Sunday school class and she was starting a children choir. She asked me to help and I tried, but everything was very chaotic and disorganized. I even tried to help her with that, but she would never listen, she would just do it her way. She was trying to get the youth to sing along with the little kids and they really didn't want to. They wanted to sing, but they wanted to sing songs they could relate to. Youth type songs. At first I bought some CD's without the words, and they performed one of them for a 5th Sunday singing. They did a great job! Everyone said so...that is except the woman...let's call her Cathy. She told me that she thought they were awful and they shouldn't have done it, if they couldn't do any better than that. She said many things but you get the drift. After that my husband and I took our kids to a youth worship conference that I was to attend, and there my husband felt that God was calling him to use his talents with music to serve God in our church. He began helping me with the youth. We had a guitar that he played and the kids sang. It was great! The kids loved it, our kids loved it, and my husband's relationship with God grew. He asked my brother to play with him and from there we formed our own little singing group. My husband and I, and my brother and his wife, and any of our kids that wanted to join in. Things was going great for us, but Cathy was very jealous to say the least. Many things happened, and I don't want to go into a lot of details unless you need more information. I tried to help her, and even helped to get her started singing on her own. She had a very pretty voice. So I got her some CD's without the words and did specials on Sunday mornings. She wasn't satisfied with anything. This friendship was getting to be a lot of work for me. No one in our church really liked her and I was constantly trying to get people to give her a chance. I was constantly sticking up for her. Meanwhile she was not making it easy for me. For some reason it seems that she was always comparing herself to me. If I was doing something, then she had to be doing the same thing. When my husband was asked to be an elder in our church she got upset. Stuff like that. Then we were asked to start a praise team in our church. This sent her over the roof. The pastor didn't think she needed to be part of it and neither did the rest of us. She caused so much trouble, it nearly destroyed our church. It did not stop with church, she started going to my family. My brothers and sisters, my kids, friends. We tried working it out with the pastor, but he and his wife was on opposite sides. It was a mess. She had started writing songs of her own and now she wanted to sing and have my husband and my brother as her praise team with me and my brother's wife out. She was very flirtatious. She came up to the church one night after we had finished practicing and asked my husband to sing a song with her at a function up on main street. The song's name was "You know I love you". He was up on a level at the altar, and she got down on one knee and begged him. He said no, but I knew what she was doing, and I didn't like it. She knew he loved music and she was trying to get him to see how much better it would be if they worked together. She did many things to hurt me and my family. Eventually it became to much. We had tried to work it out, but wasn't getting any support. So we left the church. We tried to go to a different church but it wasn't right, and eventually we quit going altogether. I lost faith in everything! My husband, my church, people in general, and yes even in God. During that time, Cathy still came by and tried to get my hubby to sing with her, and got more involved in my family. There was a disagreement between my sister and her and she went to the police station. My sister called and asked if I would go with her. Mind you I had nothing to do with any of this situation. I was just going to support my sister. We walked in the police officer told me that Cathy was not my friend and that I should stay away from her. I was just there to support my sister. I had NOT been involved at all. After that she came by one day and acted like nothing had happened. She always did this. I told her that I thought it would be for the best if we went our separate ways. This friendship wasn't doing either of us any good. She didn't even hear me. I told her what the officer had told me and she said cops lie and I shouldn't believe them. She stopped coming over after that.
That is until my brother became the new pastor at the same church we had been going to. He came by and asked us to come back. We told him the condition we was in and that we would come, but we didn't want to get involved with anything right away. We needed time to heal and get our relationship back on track with God first. He agreed. Cathy had stated going there again too and I knew it. My brother said he had her singing and he was playing guitar. We had no problem with it at all. Everything was going good. Even our older kids started coming some. All the stuff that had happened before in tis church had left our kids with a bad taste in their mouths. Then my brother started going behind my back asking my hubby to play guitar again only with Cathy, another lady, and my brother. He also plays guitar. My brother's wife didn't like Cathy and my brother standing together so he told her to get up there and sing. So she did. At first my husband refused, but he loves music and the music was in need of some help. After much talking my husband and I agreed to give it a try. The first Sunday wasn't to bad. My husband played his guitar in the back so they wasn't standing together, but the next Sunday my brother's wife wasn't up there. She had quit. This has gone on for a couple months now and I have expressed that I would like to see my husband not standing next to her. Nothing. Then this last Friday night he came home from practice and was really upset. She had volunteered the the praise team to sing at a wedding that had been planned a year in advance, the next weekend. He was gripping about all the reasons they should not do it, and slowly I got filled in that he and my brother had agreed to do this thing without talking to either of the wives. Now I will admit I was angry. I had a lot going on this weekend! Our daughter's dance recital is this weekend as well as the wedding which we are all invited to because we are distant family to the groom. I asked why did he say yes if he didn't want to and all he could say it...I don't know. I know...because she can talk anyone into anything. She's in sales and she is the top sale's person. Plus I know because I had dealt with her many times and she always got her way. What was supposed to be a good weekend for us with our kids and grand kids turned into a nightmare. Finally after much discussion my husband agreed to go to church Sunday, and tell them that he was not going to do it. He was even wanting to quit the praise team and he was even thinking about quitting church again. This time for good. He is tired of all the stress. She came up to me at church like nothing had happened and I told her to give me some space and she made it into a big scene. Come to find out my brother had not even bothered to tell his wife and she was NOT at all happy about it at all. After church the 4 of us had a long discussion. MY brother feels that it is Cathy's right to be on the praise team. His wife does not, because of her lack of spiritual maturity, and many things that she has done that reflects badly on the church. Many people quit coming as soon as they see her up on the stage. She thinks she's a star! The reason I am here asking...is I need help. My husband and I are trying to decide what to do now. My brother has not been honest with us about many things and he knows that this is causing trouble for our marriage and our family, but he doesn't seem to want to work with us. Plus he is telling my husband it is no big deal. His wife and I both disagree. What do you guys think? Please give me some advice and please pray for us and our church. I don't want to run away this time. I want to stay and fight for what is right. What ever that is. I just don't want it to cost me my marriage.
It is a long story and for that I apologize. Many years ago a married woman came to our small church. She asked me to be her friend. God told me immediately to pray. I didn't understand. I had never had a hard time making friends and I love people. I prayed that I would be a good friend to her, the kind that she needed me to be. After some time had gone by I came to know why God had asked me to pray. I was teaching the youth Sunday school class and she was starting a children choir. She asked me to help and I tried, but everything was very chaotic and disorganized. I even tried to help her with that, but she would never listen, she would just do it her way. She was trying to get the youth to sing along with the little kids and they really didn't want to. They wanted to sing, but they wanted to sing songs they could relate to. Youth type songs. At first I bought some CD's without the words, and they performed one of them for a 5th Sunday singing. They did a great job! Everyone said so...that is except the woman...let's call her Cathy. She told me that she thought they were awful and they shouldn't have done it, if they couldn't do any better than that. She said many things but you get the drift. After that my husband and I took our kids to a youth worship conference that I was to attend, and there my husband felt that God was calling him to use his talents with music to serve God in our church. He began helping me with the youth. We had a guitar that he played and the kids sang. It was great! The kids loved it, our kids loved it, and my husband's relationship with God grew. He asked my brother to play with him and from there we formed our own little singing group. My husband and I, and my brother and his wife, and any of our kids that wanted to join in. Things was going great for us, but Cathy was very jealous to say the least. Many things happened, and I don't want to go into a lot of details unless you need more information. I tried to help her, and even helped to get her started singing on her own. She had a very pretty voice. So I got her some CD's without the words and did specials on Sunday mornings. She wasn't satisfied with anything. This friendship was getting to be a lot of work for me. No one in our church really liked her and I was constantly trying to get people to give her a chance. I was constantly sticking up for her. Meanwhile she was not making it easy for me. For some reason it seems that she was always comparing herself to me. If I was doing something, then she had to be doing the same thing. When my husband was asked to be an elder in our church she got upset. Stuff like that. Then we were asked to start a praise team in our church. This sent her over the roof. The pastor didn't think she needed to be part of it and neither did the rest of us. She caused so much trouble, it nearly destroyed our church. It did not stop with church, she started going to my family. My brothers and sisters, my kids, friends. We tried working it out with the pastor, but he and his wife was on opposite sides. It was a mess. She had started writing songs of her own and now she wanted to sing and have my husband and my brother as her praise team with me and my brother's wife out. She was very flirtatious. She came up to the church one night after we had finished practicing and asked my husband to sing a song with her at a function up on main street. The song's name was "You know I love you". He was up on a level at the altar, and she got down on one knee and begged him. He said no, but I knew what she was doing, and I didn't like it. She knew he loved music and she was trying to get him to see how much better it would be if they worked together. She did many things to hurt me and my family. Eventually it became to much. We had tried to work it out, but wasn't getting any support. So we left the church. We tried to go to a different church but it wasn't right, and eventually we quit going altogether. I lost faith in everything! My husband, my church, people in general, and yes even in God. During that time, Cathy still came by and tried to get my hubby to sing with her, and got more involved in my family. There was a disagreement between my sister and her and she went to the police station. My sister called and asked if I would go with her. Mind you I had nothing to do with any of this situation. I was just going to support my sister. We walked in the police officer told me that Cathy was not my friend and that I should stay away from her. I was just there to support my sister. I had NOT been involved at all. After that she came by one day and acted like nothing had happened. She always did this. I told her that I thought it would be for the best if we went our separate ways. This friendship wasn't doing either of us any good. She didn't even hear me. I told her what the officer had told me and she said cops lie and I shouldn't believe them. She stopped coming over after that.
That is until my brother became the new pastor at the same church we had been going to. He came by and asked us to come back. We told him the condition we was in and that we would come, but we didn't want to get involved with anything right away. We needed time to heal and get our relationship back on track with God first. He agreed. Cathy had stated going there again too and I knew it. My brother said he had her singing and he was playing guitar. We had no problem with it at all. Everything was going good. Even our older kids started coming some. All the stuff that had happened before in tis church had left our kids with a bad taste in their mouths. Then my brother started going behind my back asking my hubby to play guitar again only with Cathy, another lady, and my brother. He also plays guitar. My brother's wife didn't like Cathy and my brother standing together so he told her to get up there and sing. So she did. At first my husband refused, but he loves music and the music was in need of some help. After much talking my husband and I agreed to give it a try. The first Sunday wasn't to bad. My husband played his guitar in the back so they wasn't standing together, but the next Sunday my brother's wife wasn't up there. She had quit. This has gone on for a couple months now and I have expressed that I would like to see my husband not standing next to her. Nothing. Then this last Friday night he came home from practice and was really upset. She had volunteered the the praise team to sing at a wedding that had been planned a year in advance, the next weekend. He was gripping about all the reasons they should not do it, and slowly I got filled in that he and my brother had agreed to do this thing without talking to either of the wives. Now I will admit I was angry. I had a lot going on this weekend! Our daughter's dance recital is this weekend as well as the wedding which we are all invited to because we are distant family to the groom. I asked why did he say yes if he didn't want to and all he could say it...I don't know. I know...because she can talk anyone into anything. She's in sales and she is the top sale's person. Plus I know because I had dealt with her many times and she always got her way. What was supposed to be a good weekend for us with our kids and grand kids turned into a nightmare. Finally after much discussion my husband agreed to go to church Sunday, and tell them that he was not going to do it. He was even wanting to quit the praise team and he was even thinking about quitting church again. This time for good. He is tired of all the stress. She came up to me at church like nothing had happened and I told her to give me some space and she made it into a big scene. Come to find out my brother had not even bothered to tell his wife and she was NOT at all happy about it at all. After church the 4 of us had a long discussion. MY brother feels that it is Cathy's right to be on the praise team. His wife does not, because of her lack of spiritual maturity, and many things that she has done that reflects badly on the church. Many people quit coming as soon as they see her up on the stage. She thinks she's a star! The reason I am here asking...is I need help. My husband and I are trying to decide what to do now. My brother has not been honest with us about many things and he knows that this is causing trouble for our marriage and our family, but he doesn't seem to want to work with us. Plus he is telling my husband it is no big deal. His wife and I both disagree. What do you guys think? Please give me some advice and please pray for us and our church. I don't want to run away this time. I want to stay and fight for what is right. What ever that is. I just don't want it to cost me my marriage.
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by David Honkanen on -
You know my wife and I had a similar experience with a bad music director a number of years back. Not so much in our faces. We saw the music ministry going spiritually down hill and for some reason the pastor didn't see it. It caused us both to step out of our positions in music for a while. God actually called us to go and minister music at another church with our pastors blessing. A week before we left our pastor discovered the bad things about this music directors life at that time (to my knowledge he is living for God now). He was taken out of the ministry and had stopped going to church. A little over a year later God brought us back to that church again with the blessing of the pastor from the other church. Advice
#1 You and your husband become unified in love and in spiritual warfare. This thing has to be won on your knees. If you are never in music ministry again ( I personally believe you will be) your marriage needs to be strong
#2 Pray for your pastor. You need to guard your spirit with him because he is your spiritual leader even if he is wrong on this issue. Pray that God gives him light. Since he is your brother I would ask him to get council from a pastor friend of his on this situation. Many times I've disagreed with my wife on an issue, but I learned to realize that God uses her to speak to me. Let him know I said that.
#3 This Cathy is full of rebellion. The devil would love to destroy the music ministry of your church because music is at the heart of worship to God. It strengthens faith. It restores the joy of the Lord which is your strength. When it is truly worship and not a show it brings God's presence into your auditorium where souls can be saved. Pray that God will either expose her and get her out of there or bring her to repentance and take her out of platform ministry for at least a season. (Sounds harsh, but Scriptural I promise)
Please keep me informed. If your pastor wants to write to me you can look at my profile for my email.
Blessings
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Permalink Reply by Guitarearl on -
First of all, nobody has a right to anything regarding a praise team. We have an opportunity, a calling. No amount of talent should sacrifice the heart of worship. Your brother is thinking of this from a band perspective, not a worship team perspective...and that's scary in its own right. That would be grounds enough to leave a church IMO, if the Pastor is more focused on presenting a pretty picture rather than one that glorifies Jesus Christ.
The other perspective is the husband/wife thing. Sometimes actions can be perceived to be "flirting" when they aren't. Is she interested in a tryst, or in having her own personal band, or both? I don't know, but none of that points towards "worship leader" material, and a person thinking that way needs some major Holy Spirit work.
Now, I'm a guy, so things look differently from my perspective as well. If it were me, I'd meet w/ my brother and lay it on the table. You need to show your heart, and be thinking of Christ the entire time and not yourself. If he can't recognize that there are some serious heart issues with "Cathy," then you cannot participate in his church.
Finally, you need to make sure that it is not about you, though. Pray, pray, and pray some more, especially that your brother's heart will be open to see the damage "Cathy" is creating. And you will have a daunting task in presenting this w/o coming across as someone with sour grapes because she pushed you out the door. It's all about perspective, and your brother is probably not in an objective place right now. If his heart isn't opened, I'm afraid he will probably see you as being the "displaced lead singer" with a negative agenda against "Cathy." In that case, you probably have no other choice than to leave for good.
Will be praying for you...
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Permalink Reply by Dale on -
Bev,
Your marriage takes priority over music ministry. Many fine people have fallen because their ministry became an idol. Just ask yourself, your husband, your pastor, or anyone; what is more important, music ministry or my marriage? The answer should be obvious.
Go to a different church and protect your marriage. I bet you and your husband could minister in music somewhere else, without all the poison in the air.
My 2 cents.
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Permalink Reply by Sharon Seal on -
First off you are dealing with a Jezebel spirit. This "Cathy" uses manipulation to get her way. Secondly you stated that your brother feels it's Cathys right to be on the praise team....being on a praise team isnt' a right, it's a priviledge. It's a position that should be anointed by God. By what you have stated above Cathy is not walking in a manner that God would approve of, and neither is the leadership of the church if they are allowing this. Anytime there is a conflict in church it needs to be dealt with quickly! Trust me, I am a Pastor and I have seen what can happen when you allow these kinds of problems to build up. I went from having 7 people on our praise team to two left. But it's better to have 2 people that are living the word of God on a team than to have 100 that or not doing their job to the glory of God. Cathy sounds like she's trying to divide and conquer. You are right to pray for her because she is being used by the enemy. Scripture says when someone has offended you to confront them....if they do not listen...take more with you and confront them again. I believe you have done this. Continue to pray that the Jezebel spirit on Cathy would be broken, but do not compromise what you know in your heart and spirit to be right. I will pray for you also, and your husband. I know he wants to use his gift for God and Cathy seems to want to use that to get her way, more maniupulation. I pray that God would either break the spirit upon Cathy or, remove her from your church. Unfortunately she would only wind up giving another congregation problems. So, I will stand in agreement with you that Gods will be done.
Pastor Sharon
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Permalink Reply by Beverly Basgall on -
First I want to apologize. My daughter was competing in a dance competition and I was gone. Then while we were down there my mother in law was admitted to the hospital. She is 84 and has been having problems for quite some time. We just found out that she has bone cancer on Friday. Things have been busy and I haven't even thought about the computer. We have decided to leave the church at least for now. My brother came over and took my husband off the praise team. My husband was hurt. I don't know what to think. I was hoping that my husband would make this decision, but I wanted to be able to let him make it. My brother took it out of my husband's hands. We have been having our own little church here in our home, because neither of us have heard from God where he wants us to go now. I haven't heard from my brother at all. We never told him that we was leaving. We was both kinda stunned! It took a few days for either of us to say anything to each other about it. When we did talk hubby said he just didn't feel comfortable with the way things was handled, and frankly neither did I. Things are just so messed up right now. I don't know where to turn. We live in a small community and there is not many churches here. Please pray for us!
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